Help with mating!

[jill_lovato]

Hi,

I have 2 healthy, adult Russian torts - one male and one female. They've been together for about a year, and we were really hoping they'd lay some eggs. The male attempts mating EVERY DAY (he circles the female, bobs his head, nips at her front legs, squeals) but as far as we know, he is unsuccessful. She doesn't seem to have any interest and just walks away from him and burrows.

Since they were both already adults when we got them, we have no clue of their actual age. Is is possible that they (or at least the female) are too old to mate? Or could it be becuase we don't hibernate them? We're thinking of getting a few more females and starting a nice polygamous tortoise colony 

But really, we just want them to breed so we can have baby Russians and watch them grow up!

Any ideas?

Thanks...

[AW1971]

I`d hibernate them, the male especially. Although i know of a uk breeder that breeds round the clock with success and his live in a small enclosure together,  .
 If you seperate them for a while then introduce them for shorter periods the female won`t be as stressed. If kept together the only thing she`ll want to do is get away from him and thats no life really. To form eggs the female will need plenty of calcium too.
I don`t think theres a breeding age limit but not totally sure.
Let us know if you have any success.

[jill_lovato]

thanks! I think I'll try seperating them first, and then maybe hibernation next year if there are no eggs by then.

[AW1971]

Best of luck, look forward to seeing all the baby pics 

[Joe H]

thanks! I think I'll try seperating them first, and then maybe hibernation next year if there are no eggs by then.

Have you read http://russiantortoise.org/breeding.htm
Hibernation isn't necessary nor is separation.

What is necessary is that the male and female are big enough and that the diet is great.

[AW1971]

Whilst i agree its not necessary for successful breeding  i mentioned seperation as to give the female a break as i think its kinder for her than being pestered everyday,   

[jill_lovato]

Yes, I've read the page on breeding on russiantortoise.org...it just seems like nothing is working for them  Do you think its possible that the male could be "shooting blanks" or that either one of them is sterile?

[AW1971]

How bigs the enclosure, have you provided lots and lots of areas the female can dig and make a nesting site area. From things i`ve read the female can retain the sperm for 3 years and then have eggs at a later date. Maybe its instinct that if theres nowhere shes happy with to lay eggs then she won`t have any till shes happier. Apparantly the nesting areas are preferred on a soil slope.
My knowledge is very very limited and i`m only going off reading what other breeders have written. I think Joe will be the one to help you out with this.
xx

[Joe H]

Yes, I've read the page on breeding on russiantortoise.org...it just seems like nothing is working for them  Do you think its possible that the male could be "shooting blanks" or that either one of them is sterile?

How big are they?
It could be they are too young

[jill_lovato]

The male is 5" and the female 6".

The enclosure is a big children's sandbox, filled with coconut bark substrate. There is no slope, so maybe the female needs a better spot to lay eggs? We're starting them on a healthier diet, too, so maybe that will encourage mating.

[Joe H]

They are big enough. Be patient, they will be sucessful eventually.

[AW1971]

i dont think i`d ever be able to breed mine, i`d never be able to part with the babies and i`d end up with a house full, youre all very brave. 

[Joe H]

i dont think i`d ever be able to breed mine, i`d never be able to part with the babies and i`d end up with a house full, youre all very brave. 

I onbly started breeding mine after reading the horrors of what the WC ones go through before and after they get here.

Actually thats the whole purpose of my sites. Showing people proper care and how to breed them. I would love to see them become like the corn snakes are in the USA....very popular and all CB

I've had almost 300 hatchlings so far...49 this year with a few in the incubator.  If all the keepers on this group and the YaHoo group did the same....WC would be a thing of the past

so yes its hard to part with them, but for me...its the best thing to do

BTW about half of my hatchlings this year are second generation

[AW1971]

Well you are still brave i think, i know its for an excellent cause and i think thats fantastic. But everyone would have to have home checks and go through alot before theyd get their mitts on my torts babies. See what i`m like  . I`d be no good as a breeder, i`d be sneeking in peoples gardens with my binoculars making sure they were looked after properly.
I hope one day i could though and do it for  all the imports sufferring to help them as i know youre right, what you do is great. 

[jill_lovato]

I'm not planning to sell or give away my first batch of hatchlings. Maybe after a few rounds I'd be ready, but for now we just love our two torts so much we want them to breed so we can raise their offspring, too.

Eventually, though, we'd like to be able to have a really big outside enclosure and have a whole breeding colony. But we start slowly